Music Therapy Conversations

Kiz Bangerh (now Manley) is the founder of Hip Hop Heals. Here's how she describes herself on her website: "I lost my older sister, Promila, in a car accident in 2000. After, I suffered a delayed traumatised grief reaction. I was an English Literature graduate and keen writer but experienced a creative block that lasted ten years. During this time, I trained as a secondary English teacher, and enjoyed a fruitful career in museum and gallery education. When my father died in 2010, I was in recovery from a delayed traumatised grief reaction and a breakdown. This is when I discovered therapeutic writing. My writer’s block came undone. I already had an MA in Literature and decided to do an MSc in Creative Writing for Therapeutic Purposes to share what I’d learnt about self-healing through creativity. I set up Hip Hop HEALS, a mental health project that tackles mental health inequalities in disadvantaged groups, particularly BAME groups, young people and men. We deliver poetry therapy-style workshops in schools, p

Davina Vencatasamy spoke to Sandra Schembri, the CEO of Nordoff Robbins, UK, continuing her sequence of interviews exploring diversity, race and representation in music therapy. Sandra describes herself as follows: "Over the course of my 26+ year career so far I have had the pleasure of working with some amazing organisations including Bloomberg, The Royal Academy of Arts, Ronnie Scott's Jazz Club and The House of St Barnabas, supporting further social change in the areas of music, culture, homelessness and employment. I am a "People 1st" leader and believe very deeply that "culture eats strategy for breakfast". I currently have the privilege of leading Nordoff Robbins Music Therapy UK where my music studies are being put to good use (singer, cello, clarinet). I am a proud mother of a 6-year-old force of nature and big on family, dogs, sci-fi, trees and food. There is nothing that cannot start to be solved with the help of a cup of tea with a biscuit."

Nsamu is a music therapist and psychotherapist born and raised in Zambia. Nsamu earned a BA in Psychological Counselling from the University of South Africa and MMus in Music Therapy from the University of Pretoria. A therapist grounded in holistic anti-oppressive practice, Nsamu works with people exploring health and lifestyle choices, medical complications, human sexualities and gender, spiritualities and religious experiences, psychosocial support, and learning enhancement. His music therapy experience spans health, medical, and school settings, and centres human development programming, design and facilitation, community infrastructure and social development, cross-cultural living and working. Nsamu is a classically trained singer and enjoys dancing. His interests include lifelong development, learning, and critical theory-informed research. He enjoys long-distance running and writing mystical poetry. He is a foodie, enjoys mentoring youth, and loves being an uncle. Nsamu is affiliated with the Health P

Wendy Magee has a background in practice and scholarship concerning music interventions for brain injury rehabilitation. She moved to Philadelphia in 2011, a city with the fourth largest African American population and the highest rate of deep poverty in the US. Navigating the evident inequities for marginalized people in her new home city has offered her opportunities to learn about social justice, albeit from a position of privilege. She describes herself as being at the start of a long journey of learning how to challenge the existing systems that maintain dominant narratives and ensure social inequities, of how to practice allyship, and of learning how to put well-meaning thoughts into action, saying that there is much to learn. In this episode, Wendy follows on from her seminal keynote lecture at the most recent BAMT conference, highlighting issues of race, equality and privilege with Davina.  She talks about personal and painful experiences which highlighted for her, how privilege can be present in ever

Luke talked to Barbara Wheeler about her wide ranging experience in music therapy as a researcher, clinician, educator, and author. Barbara L. Wheeler, PhD, MT-BC, holds the designation of Professor Emeritus from Montclair State University, where she taught from 1975-2000. She initiated the music therapy program at the University of Louisville in 2000, retiring in 2011. She presents and teaches in the U.S. and internationally. She has a current faculty appointment at the Karol Szymanowski Academy of Music, Katowice, Poland. She has been an active clinician throughout her career and worked with a variety of clientele. Barbara edited Music Therapy Handbook (2015); Music Therapy Research: Quantitative and Qualitative Perspectives (1995); Music Therapy Research (2nd Edition, 2005); is one of the editors of Music Therapy Research (3rd Edition; 2016); and is coauthor of Clinical Training Guide for the Student Music Therapist (1st edition, 2005; 2nd edition, 2017). She is also the author of numerous other articles a

In Episode 54, Davina Wilson talks to Michaela de Cruz. Michaela qualified in 2019 and is relatively new to music therapy but is not new to music activism. Over her 20 years as a jazz and soul performer, musician and songwriter, she has championed and contributed to causes as varied as racial awareness, gender and sexual equality and animal rights. As an activist in the music therapy scene, Michaela was on the panel for the first ever BAMT racial awareness event, which was a seminal effort for music therapy in the UK. In this podcast, Michaela speaks with her panel member Davina about the events which led to her putting her passion behind the fight for racial equality and equity in the music therapy space for both therapists and their clients, why she believes there can be no more excuses for ignorance of racial issues and discrimination in the community, as well as what she hopes to see in the future for music therapy training and practice across the UK.    Michaela works primarily in adult mental health and

Episode 53 features Francis Myerscough, who was part of the panel discussion on diversity chaired by Wendy Magee at the 2021 BAMT conference. Francis Myerscough qualified as a music therapist from the University of South Wales in 2018. They work in a number of different settings, with a background in adoption support and more recently in a local children’s services harmful sexual behaviour team. Other roles have included supporting LGBTQ+ young people at a local youth club, and as founder of and music therapist at Phoenix Song Project – a therapy organisation co-directed with and offering therapy for other members of trans and non-binary communities. There is some discussion here about language, and Francis also discusses their clinical practice, musical training and upbringing, shifts in musical identity, including instrument choice, and the importance of the voice in their therapy work. Resources Practice Your Pronouns: https://www.patreon.com/PracticeYourPronouns https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjZ0Kl2fL5

Dr. Pasiali received a BA Honors in Music Performance, from the University of East Anglia, Norwich, UK. Subsequently, she worked as a public school music teacher and a freelance flute performer in Cyprus. She completed her equivalency/Master’s degree in Music Therapy at the University of Kansas. Upon graduation, she worked as a music therapist in private practice (Ohio, US) and at the Music School Settlement (Cleveland, Ohio). She completed her PhD in Music Education with a cognate in Music Therapy at Michigan State. Currently, she is Associate & Livingstone Professor of music therapy and Chair of the Academic Honors Program at Queens University of Charlotte, North Carolina. Her research interests include early intervention, family-based music therapy, prevention, wellness and mental health, resilience, and socioemotional health. Dr. Pasiali is a regular presenter at conferences and has published in various journals. Main lecturing areas include improvisation, applied clinical techniques, and psychology o

Dr. Diane Austin DA, LCAT is the Director of the Music Psychotherapy Center in New York City where she offers a two-year post-graduate certificate program in Vocal Psychotherapy. She teaches in the graduate music therapy department at New York University. Dr. Austin has maintained a private practice in music, expressive psychotherapy and supervision for over 25 years, and has lectured and taught Vocal Psychotherapy trainings internationally. Her work has been published in numerous journals and books and translated into several languages. Diane created the first distance training program in Vocal Psychotherapy in Vancouver, B.C. and had a distance training program in Seoul, Korea for 12 years which started again virtually in 2021.  Her first international/multicultural distance training program in Vocal Psychotherapy began in 2018 at Mayfield Farm in England (about an hour from London). Her book, “The Theory and Practice of Vocal Psychotherapy: Songs of the Self” was published by Jessica Kingsley in 2010 and c

Julie Sutton works in a regional adult psychiatry NHS service for patients with severe, complex disturbance, and in private psychoanalytic practice. Having qualified in 1982 she retired from music therapy in June 2020. Over the decades her work covered most areas across the age range and she presented, lectured and examined nationally and internationally. Former Head of Training for NR London she also consulted for the Pavarotti Music Centre in Mostar. Her PhD looked at improvisation as a form of conversation & reflects a lifelong interest in relational musical processes. A BAMT Trustee for three terms, former Editor-in-Chief of the BJMT & EMTC Vice President, Julie has written about music therapy in many chapters and articles, including her books “Music, Music Therapy & Trauma” and “The Music in Music Therapy” (2002 & 2014). She is registered with the British Psychoanalytic Council and is a Board Member of the N. Ireland Psychoanalytic Society. This was an unplanned conversation that covered

Davina qualified as a music therapist from Anglia Ruskin University in 2006 and has been working in wide variety of settings ever since.  She specialised in a brief therapy model, writing her masters these in this field.  She has continued to explore this model in special educational needs settings with children and adults in schools and residential settings.  She has worked in acute and long term mental health in the NHS and continues to explore different and innovative ways of working.  She is currently one of 5 directors at Drum and Brass, a grassroots arts organisation making headway in effecting positive change in diversity and safeguarding in Leicester with dreams of changing the discourse and filling the gaps on a national landscape.  She is a registered supervisor and works closely with BAMT as their area group coordinator and CPD officer. Luke and Davina talk about racial inequalities in the UK and in music therapy. They discuss the BAMT EDI Report, as well as Davina's personal experiences of growing

Associate Professor Daphne Rickson, PhD, teaches music therapy at the New Zealand School of Music – Te Kōkī, Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand.  She has practiced music therapy and undertaken research with a range of client populations but particularly with children and adolescents in schools.  Her research has involved critical analysis of the concept of disability and investigation into music as an inclusive resource, including: Participatory Action Research with young people who have intellectual disability; an investigation into singing for wellbeing in a Christchurch school severely affected by earthquakes; song-writing with adolescents experiencing life-limiting illness; and music therapy with children who have Autism Spectrum Conditions. Daphne is co-author, with Katrina McFerran, of Creating Music Cultures in the Schools: A perspective from community music therapy (2014). One of topics she touches on in this podcast is the importance of NZ MT trainers collaborating with Maori to ensure th

Alexia Quin is the director of Music as Therapy International, a charity which she founded in 1995 and which seeks to embed music into the care and education of vulnerable people worldwide.  Alexia trained at Roehampton in the late 1990s and worked as a music therapist in the NHS for 15 years.  In 2017 she was awarded the WFMT Advocate of Music Therapy Award and in 2018 she was a member of the Commission which examined the role of music within the care and treatment of people living with dementia. Luke talked to Alexia about the genesis of the charity, which she founded before training as a music therapist. They discuss how training affected her attitude to the work of the charity, and vice versa, and talk in much detail about the many projects that have happened since, and are continuing to be developed at the moment, despite the challenges of the pandemic. After the tumultuous last year, many schools are beginning to think how they might enhance the mechanisms they have to provide universal support to stude

Ray Travasso is a Music Therapist and has been working in children’s and adult services for 18 years.  He trained at the Nordoff-Robbins Music Therapy Centre, London and graduated with a Masters in Music Therapy in 2002.  He has a background in paediatric and adult palliative care and currently works part-time as a Music therapist and Team Leader at The Treehouse, East Anglia’s Children’s Hospices, Ipswich, Suffolk. He is also Director and co-founder of Suffolk Music Therapy Services, an organisation that provides Music Therapy to children and adult care services across East Anglia.  Suffolk Music Therapy Services delivers Music therapy in over 60 organisations in the region, including hospices, care homes, neurorehabilitation centres, schools, charities and private individuals.  Ray leads a team of 15 highly skilled and trained music therapists and is keen to increase access to Music Therapy to more organisations and individuals across the region. Ray talked to Luke about the genesis of his own music therapy

Episode 45 is part 2 of Luke's interview with Alex Maguire, music therapist at Broadmoor high security hospital. Alex talks in some detail about his clinical work in this episode, and some of the important theories he draws on to support his work. The episode also includes Alex's interview with Shamrat Sengupta. Shamrat Sengupta is an Indian renaissance man - in addition to his role as a consultant psychiatrist, he is also a barrister and an actor/writer /performer with the group Eastern Thespians. He is the co-creator of the Bloomsbury Cultural Formulation Interview and is the Responsible Clinician for the mental illness admissions ward at Broadmoor. Also included in the episode are two further excerpts from Alex's performance live at the Vortex Jazz Club in Dalston. The Vortex is a true gem of the UK jazz scene and has done well to survive through lockdown. See the website for details of upcoming gigs.

Alex Maguire is Senior Music Therapist at Broadmoor high security hospital specialising in working with high dependency and intensive care patients. He has presented his work at numerous conferences and has contributed to the books Forensic Music Therapy (JKP 2012), ‘Forensic Arts Therapies –Anthology of Practice & Research’, (FA Press 2016), ‘Working Across Modalities in the Arts Therapies: Creative Collaborations’ (Routledge 2017) and 'Violent States and Creative States; from the Global to the Individual’ (JKP 2018). The Broadmoor Hospital choir for both staff and patients, which he co-founded, has been commended in the Arts and Health Awards, and performs widely at hospital functions, as well as providing a Christmas visiting service to the intensive care wards. Alex has presented at the IAFP Conference in 2008, 2012, 2016, 2017 and 2020. He has a parallel life as an improvising jazz pianist performing and recording in Europe and further afield. This episode includes two interviews conducted by Alex wi

Nate Holder BA, MMus is a musician, author, speaker and music education consultant based in London. He is an advocate for decolonising music education and has been writing, speaking and consulting on the subject for the last five years. Nate brings his passion and skill in public speaking into leading CPD training and workshops; helping address bias and underrepresentation in music classrooms, departments, hubs and boards across the UK.  His first book, 'I Wish I Didn’t Quit: Music Lessons', became an Amazon bestseller and is currently available worldwide. His second book, ‘Why Is My Piano Black and White’, was released in Sept 2020. Nate talked about his own musical education, and what might be missing from mainstream education more generally, in particular due to racial bias. We also discuss his poem, 'If I Were a Racist', featured on his #decolonisemusiced blog, including the reactions to this, both positive and negative. Nate also refers to his own experience of music therapy, taking a music therapy modul

Marianne Rizkallah is the Director and Head Music Therapist at North London Music Therapy, 'Music Therapy Outreach and Enterprise Tutor' for the Guildhall School of Music & Drama, and the Vice Chair of the British Association for Music Therapy. Founded in 2018, North London Music Therapy provides music therapy for anyone, of any age, with a mental health condition such as stress, anxiety or depression. NLMT provides music therapy for individuals and groups, designs and delivers workshops for the corporate market, and provides further training and CPD for qualified and trainee music therapists. NLMT specialises in long-term work, and believes that therapy should be offered for as long as someone feels they need it, running counter to the prevailing therapy model in the UK. As a music therapist, Marianne has worked with clients aged from 1 to 100, with conditions as varied as psychosis, autism, learning disabilities and dementia. For NLMT, she works with clients with anxiety. Marianne is also a professional

  Luke interviewed eight colleagues from the team at Oxleas Music Therapy Service about their experiences of adapting practice during lockdown. This has inevitably included a wide range of experiences, some very positive, some frustrating, but all of them demonstrating the ability of music therapists to adapt and improvise in a crisis, keeping the children and young people they are working with at the centre of their practice. You can also find a shorter edit of this project (with a musical bonus) on the service website. Here are their biogs in order of appearance: Sarah Hadley is the manager of Oxleas Music Therapy Service. You can see a more extensive biog for Sarah in the notes for her own episode of Music Therapy Conversations (Episode 36 from March 2020). Oonagh Jones is Principal Music Therapist at Oxleas NHS Foundation Trust where she is Caseload Manager and Lead for the Under 5s service.  Oonagh works in mainstream, special schools and children's centres; with a particular interest in working with chi

Amelia Oldfield feels incredibly lucky to have worked as a clinical music therapist in the NHS for 40 years. In the early 1980s she worked full-time with people with learning disabilities for six years, and then part-time with pre-school children and their families referred from a child development centre, as well as with primary aged children and their families in a child and family psychiatric unit. In 1994, she and her colleague, Helen Odell-Miller, jointly set up the MA music therapy training course at Anglia Ruskin University, and Amelia has taught music therapy students on this course since that time. She has particularly enjoyed running workshops to enable and encourage students to develop clinical music therapy improvisation skills on single line instruments. It has always seemed very important to continue to be active clinically herself during her teaching, as her clinical music therapy work inspired her teaching, and her teaching made her think about her clinical work in a rigorous and critical way.